Might makes right, the strongest can impose their will on whoever they want!

you can kill John Wayne Gacy, Dahmer, or Bundy cause it would make you just as bad

People who think like this are mouthbreathing idiots who shouldn't be taken seriously

is that really the world you want to live in?

the point is then missed by the fact that superman is doing it and he will go all the way

And its easy to say killing people is so great when you haven't been the a victim

duh, because the victim would be dead, idiot, that's why we have to kill terrorists, murderers and pedophiles.

your example would work if you didn't use criminals who actually got caught, trialed and sentenced to death

Manchester black is literally committing the first position fallacy
He thinks killing bad guys will lead to a better world without ever considering that he might be the bad guy that would be killed
He drops his moral superiority the moment he sees what being on the receiving end is like

if this was written better, manchester would have told-you-so'd superman at the end
superman would have lost
lol children don't know shit

their thing wasn't might makes right it was "ends justify the means". They even say that phrase exactly. None of them abused their powers for self-gain because they're born strong like superfag, they were all victims of villains whose only interest was to solve the villain crisis permanently.

i swear this is some kind of revisionism by supercucks because their self-insert is so dumb they gotta concoct an argument the opponent didn't even make.

I mean, Superman's so boring that having the bestest superpowers ever-er is his only character, so no wonder that's the only argument he could make. Therefore pretend the argument is about might makes right instead of the real argument that Superman protects cannibals, jews and rapists for daddy status quo.

and just admit it's a corporate mandate

In DC, it never was
Superman and batman stopped killing long before the CCA and both due to the writers and not the company

Superman had shifted away from killing entirely due to jerry siegel and joe shuster thinking it made more sense for the character
While batman had only been suggested not to kill by editorial, not a mandate, and bill finger thought it was a good idea regardless and wished he had implemented sooner

But he only killed terrorists, who are obviously wrong and everyone agreed with him.

without ever considering that he might be the bad guy

fooooooorrrr...doing what?
a hero being on the receiving end makes no sense when they're looking to help others. Murderers and rapists are looking to harm others and should expect to be on the receiving end.

a hero being on the receiving end makes no sense when they're looking to help others.

A hero being a violent killer shouldn't be surprised when violence comes knocking on his door

he literally killed innocent people and shrugged them as collateral and killed families because they were related to villains

he should be surprised. Only a villain would attack a hero for saving others. That's what villains do (or superbaby)

kek
look at him seething cause some kids said the new guys are cooler than him

"is that really the world you want to live in?

The problem is that we already live in that world and it's part of human nature unless you want to put us all in a jar.
And I'm not even defending Manchester Black, because he acts like a retard.

Hmmm today I will antagonize a living god with the goal of making him agree killing is moral.

Attack a guy for raping my daughter

Everyone cheers because he'd been raping their families too

Local Down Syndrome Special kid waddles over and starts fighting me

"DUUUHHH HOW DYOU LIKE IT???"

Anyone who says its "human nature" doest know shit for dick what they're talking about

DUUUHHH HOW DYOU LIKE IT???

Thats a strawman and you know it

It would be like if you gunned criminals down in cold blood and then told everyone else you did what the courts couldn't do and that what you did was for the best
Obviously, its easy to say that when youve never had to look a barrel down
And when a counter-vigilante has you at gunpoint, you cant just cry about how this isnt fair when he is doing what you are doing

Anyone who says its "human nature" doest know shit for dick what they're talking about

Of course... because more than 10,000 years of human history where we kill each other and where we have never had an era of real peace mean nothing.

They made Invincible for mouthbreathers like you
Why don't you go slurp up that slop like a good boy

This is the dumbest thing I've ever read. Did you even think about it before writing it?

Oh, this thread again.

If you want to pretend like you’re not doing a strawman then use irl criminals who are actually above the law like Superman’s villains, like the Cartel or Pablo Escobar.

Would you be justified to shoot them? Hell yeah. Would their entire country thank you for doing it? Hell yeah.

And who would get pissed at you? Some spoiled californian liberal on twitter halfway across the world who says “you probably don’t know what it was like to be that poor heckin minorities Escobar staring down a gun without the court saying so!” That’s Superman. Only Superman would think the avenger is the same as the untouchable drug dealer torturer.

Why do you keep making these threads?

inb4 this is totally my first thread

This is the 50th “HURR DURR WHY WONT THESE SUPERHEROES KILL THREAD”

Supersoiboy thinking anyone other than himself is the slop pig

LMAO

Superheroes are fucking gay by default because it always feels like they're superheroes because they enjoy being superheroes and playing with their supervillains. If you aren't willing to take a life, you shouldn't be someone who takes on the role of a "defender".

When the system fails it is the duty of the citizen to protect themselves against it.
That’s written in the constitution so it’s way more of “the american way” than whatever neoliberal jewish pozz superman is

Yeah that is what villains do (The Elite do). The Elite don't care about regular people, all they care about is killing people they don't like or think "deserve it".
Their solution to ending a conflict between two countries (an incredibly complex issue) was to murder the leaders of both countries. They do not care about saving people.

Might makes right!

Okay here I go using my might on you

N-no you can’t do that! (Literally cries)

Take your (you) and go

I want to see a storyline where a regular person kills the Joker in a self defense shooting and Batman has the biggest meltdown in the universe over it.

was to murder the leaders of both countries.

And those leaders are innocent? I mean, they're sending innocent people to die over an argument they could have resolved without violence.

This is way Senator Armstrong is one of the most based characters to every exist.

Might Makes Right and I will make America Great Again

Okay here I go using my might on you

I'm proud of you son, you deserved to beat me, I die knowing I was beaten by a superior warrior

the Elite attack villains, not heroes.
Superman, ironically, was the one who attacked them for killing the same kidnappers who had mutilated and crippled one of their teammates in a dungeon. And who Superman admitted he knew would not be punished otherwise.
Superman’s just a faggy baby who cares more about his ego than helping people

My Batman wouldn't care.

Jack also adopts this ideology afterwards btw

I like that Raiden looked stupid when he realized he had proven Armstrong right.

Funny enough your page brings up an interesting point referring to law. People always bitch and moan about kill rules but nobody ever talks about due process.

Bluh bluh would you let a murderer go? Well, would you murder a murderer without proving he did it?

I would if the system is corrupt and lets him get away with it, thus perverting due justice.
The grand irony is that multiple times throughout the story Superman admits the system in his setting is extremely corrupt and he knows it. But he does nothing to fix it, just throws a tantrum at those who are then says “well now it’s good because i got my way”

Batman wouldn't care

He respects the law

Also in his convo about menagerie’s torturers, he even insists it’s a good thing that those torturers will get away scott free without punishment because “well i’ll just stop them next time too (: ”

Let Batman go, you sick fuck. You can't own people, even if they insist on dressing up like animals.

first position fallacy

explain this one plz?

but nobody ever talks about due process.

The incompetence of the authorities? Corrupt judges? Or the fact that most trials take too long?

Remember in Germany that liberal female judge letting the migrant rapist gang off on probation, then giving a family member who complained about it an actual prison sentence?

That’s the side of Superman.

Maybe I'm just being overly critical of Batman, but you're probably right. He'd probably be upset that he lost the faint hope of rehabilitating Joker, but I doubt he'd do anything about it since it would be a lawful act of self defense. Could also be one of those situations where he shows up as Bruce Wayne to check in on the guy who killed Joker and give him a job or something.

ah yes
I to can fake antidotal stories to without proofs

Europeans are so cucked, its unbelievable. Hitler weeps that the gayest form of authoritarianism possible is now the norm is his precious Reich.

Yeah. At the end of No Mansand he gives Gordon express permission to kill Joker but Gordon shoots his leg instead.

msn.com/en-us/news/other/judge-gives-immigrant-a-fine-for-raping-15-year-old-man-protesting-decision-gets-sick-news-from-court-report/ar-AA1v84Kv

to

Gordon shoots the Jokers leg with the intention of not killing him

bullet hits a major artery and Joker bleeds out waiting for an ambulance

kek

He begs Gordon not to, saying everyone’s been through enough and that Gordon will only make it worse and do what Joker wants if he does this and etecetera. He just says he won’t attack him so he can make the right choice himself.

A situation in which a character promotes an action, revolution or social system that harms or will harm other people, under the assumption that it will not harm them. They will invariably discover that they were wrong, with the double whammy of knowing they supported the measure that caused their suffering when they thought it would happen to 'somebody else'.

Copy pasted from tv tropes

The problem is that we already live in that world and it's part of human nature unless you want to put us all in a jar.

Rape and murder is part of human nature and we still try our best to keep it in check and punished

For whatever the stronger being damn well pleases. Why should he feel the need to justify himself?

thanks

Nice argument which only Superman made, and Black never did in the entire story:

links to fake sites

as yes

So Manchester was right but Superman is stronger so he gets to do what he wants.

The thing of it is, the reason you have due process is to avoid people just killing people and after the fact saying "Yeah no bro they totally deserved it." Not only does that ensure the wrong person doesn't get punished for a crime they didn't do but it's also to help ensure you don't miss the right criminal by prosecuting the wrong person. And yes, it's slow, because you have to be sure.

see the story in question sucks not because of that but because rather than having an actual argument it's just

hmmmm you think we should kill bad guys? what's next, civilians????????????

Manchester was wrong in that just cause someone CAN beat the shit out of all the criminals doesn't mean that you should just blindly accept their judgement of the situation like a meek little shit. Otherwise he wouldn't have cried like a little bitch and begged Superman to stop, he'd have just accepted that he fucked up and given Superman permission to cut his head off.

Probably with this is the fact that people who are clearly vile pieces of shit just get off with slaps on the wrist or no punishment at all because of retarded, corrupt DAs. I get want you mean, though. Vigilantism is bad not because evil people deserve to live or anything, but because there are times where vigilantes are going off bad information and target the wrong person.

The issue is the creators and stories can't accept it. Shit like this was written to morally and logically justify the logically unjustifiable nonsensical restraints of never ending superhero comics. The right answer is just not think about it but the people who make them can't stop thinking and writing about it.

the coloring's ver nice. Like a more psychedelic All Star Superman. Manchester Black and the team are cool concepts for heroes, if they were their own book i'd be interested.
but yeah the argument and state lapdog portrayal is terrible. Ironically classic Superman's whole schtick was being an stern third party who corrupt authorities and businessmen could not boss around.

Yeah, better make extra sure that the fucking scarecrow is the guy that did all those gas murders, there's a chance you could be wrong.

the Elite attack villains

And what happens when they decide that, after having killed all the major villains, they're gonna start killing minor "villains" for minor infractions? That's the whole point of Superman's issue with The Elite: Once you think a hammer is your only solution, you start seeing nails everywhere.

Superman, like most other superheroes who aren't antiheroes like Punisher, sees violence as a responsibility - which is to say, he sees it as something to use only when necessary. There's that story where he's walking down a street and hears a kid in trouble who's being abused by his dad. When he saves the kid, the dad comes in, and Supes is PISSED. And Supes could've killed the dad easy peasy. Who's gonna stop him? But he didn't kill the abusive prick - he took him to the police, then warned him that if anything ever happened to the kid again, there would be worse consequences. The Elite likely would've beaten the dad, if not outright killed him.

The whole fight with The Elite is about Superman showing the world what The Elite's "solution" to crime would look like: wanton destruction and soulless murder, all in the name of "the law" as enforced by an all-powerful executioner. Yes, the world sucks, but would it be better if we let people like The Elite or, say, Judge Dredd decide who deserves to live or die based on who they believe deserves to die - especially when that idea can always expand to include others?

It is a great example of the Original Position Fallacy: You might think it's fair to let The Elite kill criminals...up until the point where they decide you're a criminal, in which case you'll probably think it's unfair as hell (right before you get got).

just cause someone CAN beat the shit out of all the criminals doesn't mean that you should j

Why? Because he himself doesn't want to be beaten to death? That's not a good argument. So the guy that made a good point is a bitch, who cares?

I'm 100% sure there's been a storyline where something like this has happened, where someone's used fear toxin to frame the scarecrow or something. Good money on it being a reformed rogue who's trying to stay low getting framed by a former rival too.

Shit like this was written to morally and logically justify the logically unjustifiable nonsensical restraints of never ending superhero comics

My favorite was when someone on Anon Babble said Peter Parker is justified in not killing Norman Osborn because he's his friend Harry's father.

He's the one proposing "He who has power makes the rules". So him trying to whine to Superman that he "can't do that" implies an exception to his proposal, meaning his word only ever lasted up until it backfired on him. If the fucker who proposed his own rules refuses to live up to them, then it's clearly not a rule that's sustainable.

I mean even if you've got one instance of a frame job, that doesn't remove the countless other cases.

The thing is that theres a difference between killing someone in the middle of a fight, and executing a prisoner without a trial.
IIRC, the elite were doing the former.They were violent and killed villains when they fought, but they weren't executing people after they surrendered.

It's worth noting that they are apparently a parody of the authority from wildstorm.

It's been a while since i read the superman vs elite comic though.

The Elite do have a pretty cool design ngl

He's the one proposing

It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter who came up with the idea (and let's face it, it wasn't an original thought nobody ever had until then). It's like if a pedophile exposes how politicians get away with slaps on the wrists for things regular people would get 20 to 30 years in jail but then you said "who cares what the kid fucker says?"

He's the one proposing "He who has power makes the rules"

no he's not. When in the story did he ever propose this?
It was a strawman argument Superman came up with himself so he can dodge the actual things Black proposed

Which is why you have a judicial system to review cases. If it doesn't work? Fucking reform it.

You got guys who can invent jet powered tanks and men who can lift skyscrapers but you can't enact some fucking judicial restructuring?

This. Goddamn it's why Clark is so stupid in this book

the system is corrupt and helps these criminals. If we don't take matters into our own hands more people will be hurt as a result

NOOOOO MIGHT DOESN'T MAKE RIGHT

Black never even mentioned his superpowers or anything

The thing is that theres a difference between killing someone in the middle of a fight, and executing a prisoner without a trial.

And what happens when The Elite skip the idea of trial and letting people surrender? That's what Superman was trying to show the world when he fought The Elite and faked their deaths: When he who has the power makes the rules, the rules stop applying to he who has the power. Superman didn't give The Elite a chance to surrender before whooping their asses.

Supes doling out violence to supervillains (who can take it) as a means of protecting innocents is fine. Supes doling out violence as vengeance or enforcing his moral code upon society is not. That's the difference between The Elite and Superman: The Elite wanted to enforce their moral code with violence, while Superman wants to enforce the law while showing people a morally righteous way to live that doesn't involve hurting people unnecessarily.

The Authority and the Elite are pretty different characters, despite the comparisons.

If someone's going around killing people claiming that those with the power to mold the world are the unassailable authority, they better not pussy out when they find a bigger fish and thus a more unassailable authority than them. Otherwise they look like real big retards for advocating a system of law they can't follow when it actually matters

Literally from the book, you jackass

"Rule One: He Who Has The Power Makes The Rules"

they are also not as strong as superman, he doesnt have to fight as hard as they do

Yeah the Elite are parodies lf anti-heroes *like* the authority. Not the Authority specifically

The Authority and the Elite are pretty different characters, despite the comparisons.

Yeah the Elite are parodies lf anti-heroes *like* the authority. Not the Authority specifically

The characters dont all have direct analogues, but they have intentional similarities. Like the extradimensional base. (Its been a while since I read the authority comics, so i dont remember others atm)

Oh definitely. I just note it cause every bait thread like this will complain that the book sucks cause it fails to address the faults of The Authority, when the book is more attacking the public perception that heroes should imitate The Authority's methods without considering why they do what they do, hence The Elite trying to treat the Detective Comics World as if it's as bleak and muddy as the Wildstormverse.

This is probably the most well-articulated explanation of this point I've seen in one of these threads.

Superman wants to enforce the law while showing people a morally righteous way to live

wants to enforce the corrupt law and showing people an obedient, brainless way to suffer under the state's boot
Guy was giving the Elite an ultimatum of either fight them or let Superman arrest them and put them in jail for helping people. The morally righteous thing is to not be a willing slave.

they better not pussy out

Why? You can't look up to them anymore?

now post the full quote. He says that because Superman punched one of his teammates (for getting revenge on her torturers), not because he wants to do whatever hedonism he wants

wants to enforce the corrupt law and showing people an obedient, brainless way to suffer under the state's boot

Would you have preferred Superman become the boot? Because, again, that was his entire point: When you let people like The Elite control who lives and who dies, you give up the right to argue when they decide you deserve to die - after all, you let them pick off everyone else when you thought you wouldn't be put against the wall.

No one here is going to deny (or should deny) that government isn't corrupt. Same goes for the criminal justice/legal system. But those systems have checks and balances that are theoretically meant to help correct (or prevent) mistakes from hurting people. The Elite and Superman, were they to become "the law", have no such checks on their authority. They become the law - judge, jury, and executioner, all in one.

I'd rather have an imperfect system of laws and enforcement thereof than live under the boot of an authoritarian. What about you?

Duh. Fuck hypocrites who don't practice what they preach.

No, he punched out Hat after Hat was about to kill a shitton of people who were only ever vaguely related to a bunch of secret agents they already killed. An action which not only would have been pointless since the guys they killed aren't coming back, but would have been an act of violence against people completely unrelated to the actual inciting incident.

And what happens when they decide that, after having killed all the major villains, they're gonna start killing minor "villains" for minor infractions?

When does anything like this actually happen?

lol children don't know shit

They know more than you and half this thread.

And what happens when The Elite skip the idea of trial and letting people surrender?

That's is a good question to ask, but the thing is when do the elite actually do that? Was it with the human traffickers?

Anyways when they kill the villains in tokyo. Manchester black says he had to do it, otherwise tokyo would have been destroyed.
And in the comic superman starts calling them murderers RIGHT after they kill the villains in tokyo. There's no nuance in what he is doing either.

(to be fair I suppose they had to fit the story in the limited page space of the average comic book issue)

In the comic he punches hat, not the lady bonded to the symbiote

Would you have preferred Superman become the boot?

Yes, because there's a world of difference between justice against those who are clearly evil and get away with it and have gotten away with it for decades, and randomly starting to attack innocent civilians and heroes.
That Superman has to equate the Elite to the likes of The fucking Joker or Zsasz speaks volumes about how disingenuous his entire stance is. A Boot that strikes at the heart of evil is a welcome boot.

Agreeing with yourself when the book literally proves you wrong is sad.

Every storyline with evil superman ever. It's either that or lobotomizing a ton of people.

lying

as expected of a Superhomo
Hat was going to kill ALIENS who has Crippled, Amputated and Tortured Menagerie. Noone unrelated was even there on the scene or in the radius.

Once the Cartel takes over American politics too superfag will be kissing their boots next.

Extremist governments like the Nazis and soviets

Exact words

"Hat, tell the streets to swallow them all, then rain acid on all of their families. That ought to send a message."

It wasn't just the aliens he was going after, he was targeting the rogue government agents and anyone related to them. Which is about as logical as killing the distant cousin of a serial killer that's never even heard of him just because they're on the same family tree.

when do the elite actually do that?

They don't do it in the comic, but that's the whole point of Superman's problem with their use of violence as a solution: Sooner or later, if they're allowed to keep being demigods, things'll devolve into The Elite becoming the metahuman version of Judge Dredd and hurting or killing anyone who so much as pisses them off a little.

there's a world of difference between justice against those who are clearly evil and get away with it and have gotten away with it for decades, and randomly starting to attack innocent civilians and heroes

But when those who have the ultimate power decide the difference is minimal enough that it doesn't exist, what's to stop them from attacking anyone who wouldn't otherwise be attacked but for he who has the power? THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE STORY: For as flawed and fucked-up as our legal system is, it's still better than allowing powerful people to punish transgessors with lethal violence based only on the say-so of those powerful people.

Nature is the strong eating the weak.
Civilization is the strong protecting the weak.
If you want Nature, fine, but don't expect to maintain the comforts of Civilization.

like the Nazis

It always fucking comes back to this.

We have to coddle criminals because the shoah

They don't do it in the comic, but that's the whole point of Superman's problem with their use of violence as a solution: Sooner or later, if they're allowed to keep being demigods, things'll devolve into The Elite becoming the metahuman version of Judge Dredd and hurting or killing anyone who so much as pisses them off a little.

That's a good point, but he makes this argument right after they save tokyo from being destroyed

Supermanchild so low iq and mindbroken he can't interpret a turn of soeech

Now please post the Aliens' families who were totally there anon.
That is surely something you can see on the page right? It's not just the criminal murderous aliens who dropped down from the ufo and noone else, about to be killed, right?
You really are a woman, right?

Bro he asked for examples and I gave him some

Duh. Fuck hypocrites who don't practice what they preach.

You are a child. The type that will stop listening to a type of music because "douches and hypocrites do".

For as flawed and fucked-up as our legal system is, it's still better than allowing powerful people to punish transgessors with lethal violence

It's not. The difference is that anyone with a brain can tell the difference between evil (Joker) and good (Elite). Everyone but Superman, because the assumption of mental autonomy is foreign to him. People must only let the state tell them what to think, always.

soviets

It always fucking comes back to this.

We have to coddle criminals because the holodomor

Superman defended organ trafficking aliens from one of their victims, while admitting he knows they will be helped and not punished by the justice system. He's culpable.

Considering you're in a thread while screeching about how nobody should take Superman seriously because you think he's a hypocrite...

Anon, you know that I'm talking about the comic book, right? Where you can see Superman explicitly calling out that there were rogue Department of Extranormal Operations agents at the scene that are 100% human, right? Do...do you have brain damage? Or are you outright arguing something that you just made a headcanon out of?

Might makes right was Manchester's point
Nobody likes being the receiving end of said might is Superman's point.

he makes this argument right after they save tokyo from being destroyed

So what? Doing good doesn't mean they're incapable of doing bad. Power reveals who someone is, and given the power to kill with little-to-no impunity revealed Manchester and his friends as people who were more than willing to kill for what they perceive to be "the greater good". It's the same kind of shit you see in fucking Kira from Death Note: He starts out killing high-profile criminals, but then he starts killing everyone from petty criminals to people getting in his way, all in service of a "new world" that'll be "free from crime". It's sociopathic shit.

The holdomor actually happened and the holocaust didn't, faggot. Dilate.

Бpaтaн, oн пoпpocил пpимepы, и я дaл eмy нecкoлькo.

I will prove you do not want to live in a world that exposes your virtues

Angry God

It works. When you pray to a god of strength, do not ask for mercy.

The Elite aren't good, though. They're bullies who just went after politically convenient targets that everyone okayed until it was Superman.

When you pray to a god of strength, do not ask for mercy.

CROM. I HAVE NEVER PRAYED TO YOU BEFORE.

Take your dementia pills anon.

The reason why Superman threw the punch was because they were talking about raining acid on the families of the individuals involved.

The full meaning of his quote “No one throws a punch at one of my people and walks” isn’t justified retribution but strictly “defy us and you and your everyone you’ve loved and known will suffer.”

The effect the Elite had was also bad with the public. With them doling out extrajudicial justice, the public became more bloodthirsty and want criminals to be outright killed rather than rehabilitated through the rules-based systems of law.

and want criminals to be outright killed rather than rehabilitated

Fuck you. That's how every society in the world worked until the 20th century and it was infinitely better than what we have today.

That mentality is exactly what he's talking about

Faggot.

and their families are there? no? It's just them and they joke about their "families too", who aren't even there to be swallowed by the streets?

Wait, you mean to tell me the ONLY PEOPLE ON THE PAGE A BOUT TO BE KILLED (which apparently i can read, and you can't) are the GUILTY PARTIES...

and then Superliberalcuckold threw a crying baby fit because they were gonna kill get their rightful revenge on them? Damn what a fag, no wonder you self-insert as him LMAO

*kills you*

Read the comic anon. It's a joke about how much they deserve it, he says to collapse the road underneath them. Their families aren't even there.

Superman protects murderers and throws tantrums when their victims want revenge

b-but these villains joked about killing family members too (who aren't even there) so my self-insert is in the right!!!

Anon, how much more explicit does Manchester Black need to be when he outright tells a magician "rain down acid on their families, that ought to send a message" to make it clear he's not joking? As in, something he is outright capable of doing, and have never joked about killing off someone they didn't intend to before?

Don't make me tap the sign, OP.

but I doubt he'd do anything about it since it would be a lawful act of self defense.

What about those times when the Punisher and Jason Todd had guns to the Jokers head and Batman attacked them

governments that kill criminals will also start killing innocent people for no reason

even though this hasn't been the case for the entirety of human history until very recently

Why are you so fucking ignorant about how the world actually works?

stop making this thread

Anon, how long do you need to self-insert before you cannot even tell a joke apart from reality, just because it makes your self-insert look rational (for protecting murderers)
their families aren't even fucking there. They don't even exist, half of them are aliens from a fucking ufo

The threads will continue until capeshitters stop sucking criminal cock.

*kills you*

Uhhhh, anon, your Philippines? Your "to stop drugs we'll just get civilians to go around murdering anyone who uses drugs"?

So you really are working off your own headcanon of the book. Got it. Then there's nothing further to talk about, since you're not even looking at the actual text anymore.

So what? Doing good doesn't mean they're incapable of doing bad. Power reveals who someone is, and given the power to kill with little-to-no impunity revealed Manchester and his friends as people who were more than willing to kill for what they perceive to be "the greater good". It's the same kind of shit you see in fucking Kira from Death Note: He starts out killing high-profile criminals, but then he starts killing everyone from petty criminals to people getting in his way, all in service of a "new world" that'll be "free from crime". It's sociopathic shit.

He doesn't try reasoning with them, he just starts off attacking them and comparing them to the nazis, right after black says they would have destroyed tokyo. And superman gets real ANGRY a few sentences in to the discusison. He calls them murderes and starts shouting at them.

He doesn't tell talk about how violence isn't always the answer, he doesn't point out how vigilantes can sometimes kill the wrong targets, supermans just seethes at valid points Manchester black brings up and then gets really angry at the elite .

I think the issue is the comic wasn't actually that well written. They could have had an actual discussion about killing villains, but its just like a few sentences traded.

muh slippery slope

Sounds like Superman frankly. Elite actually care about helping people, Superman was literally seething like a bitch for a full page because some little kids called the Elite cooler than him so he declared he's arresting them for their crimes (conveniently never turns himself in for his crimes)

You have to be 18 to post.

Grow the fuck up.

What's the problem with killing drug dealers, faggot?

The problem is that wasn't what I said, anon.

people who use drugs

you're jumping through hoops anon.
That wordplay might be a little too hard for you to grasp, given you're a Superman fan.

Elite actually care about helping people

maturity means coddling people who want to rape murder, and rob you

people who use drugs

Never just "do drugs". They're usually also thieves at the very least.

The effect the Elite had was also bad with the public. With them doling out extrajudicial justice, the public became more bloodthirsty and want criminals to be outright killed rather than rehabilitated through the rules-based systems of law.

He could have brought that up.There are a lot of valid arguments or situations where killing criminals/villains is the wrong thing to do, but superman doesn't actually bring them up.

see californians, s m h

Dare I ask, what Superman comics/runs would you recommend to someone looking to get into Superman, but only the best stuff? Bonus points if it's the Black Suit.

The Elite free Libya and take revenge for victims

Superman has a whole story about refusing to do anything to help Libya, cries and threw a tantrum when Antaeus did then guilt tripped him into killing himself, punishes victims and protects murderers

The Elite help people. Superman helps his own image.

Kind of need to take the good with the bad, anon, but consider Kryptonite Nevermore as a starting point

Usually

That's not as much certainty as I'd want when murder's involved, anon. If someone's got a prescription and people see them taking their medicine and declare they're a drug user, in a world where we've decided due process doesn't matter, who's to keep that person from getting lynched?

This guy doesn't understand timestamps.

And I'm sure Libya stayed liberated instead of just electing a new horrible warlord to rule them because the Elite stayed to actually help rebuild instead of fucking off to go kill more people, right?

This thread proves this should've been a grpahic novel and not an issue. The animated movie comes close but I really think this discussion deserves more time in the oven.

Actually looks good, thanks for the rec!

I cannot think of a single benefit the modern world has gotten from prison rehabilitation. No inventions, no humanitarians, nothing good.

On the other hand there's countless cases of recidivism and past victims being murdered by supposed "rehabilitated" criminals.

And I'm sure Libya stayed liberated instead of just electing a new horrible warlord to rule them because the Elite stayed to actually help rebuild instead of fucking off to go kill more people, right?

This is a good point, but i feel like the comic is badly written.
why doesnt superman bring that up with the elite?

Slippery slopes can happen; that they don't always happen is a testament to those who have actual principles and ethics beyond "fuck you, got mine". The point I'm making is that preventing a slippery slope from happening is better than letting one happen and going "whoops, kinda fucked up there, oh well". Superman letting The Elite do their thing without stepping in would've eventually led to the kind of shit that exemplified Kira: violence and death in the name of what The Elite considered to be "the greater good", regardless of who that "greater good" would ultimately hurt or leave behind.

And I'll keep mentioning Kira because he became a killer after coming into possession of great power. The Elite had great power, and they saw it as a way to enforce their idea of "the greater good" just like Kira used the Death Note to enforce his idea of "the greater good". Both The Elite and Kira started out killing people who "deserved" to be killed. But whereas Superman stopped The Elite before they could go further than that, Kira wasn't stopped until he'd killed thousands of people, including people whose only "crime" was trying to catch Kira.

Power revealed The Elite and Kira as fascist sociopaths who wanted to use their powers to instill their morality and their ideas of justice upon the world. Their intentions may have been noble, but their actions sure as shit weren't.

don't know, they didn't show what happened afterwards. Just Clark seething self-righteously because "it's not our place to intervene/save innocents/protect the innocent"

read

Nah that’s you they’re explicitly talking about the MIB human agents that are also involved in that scheme that you’re conveniently not posting.

This is a pretty american perspective, considering this country does everything it possibly can to ensure a regular influx of prisoners.

Which is just a pure coincidence considering most american prisons are privately owned and have a vested interest in having people to loan out for cheap labor.

He is the same autist who goes to Anon Babble to sperg over "moralfags" until he gets buttblasted by >pic and the janitors bans him from Anon Babble for a while.

because his only mention of it was this where they have the short ugly office jerk agree with their newspaper story and tall handsome reader-avatar Clark say "ackshually that's bad chud" ironically they confirm this was the fucking Gaddafi which would alienate anyone who knows anything about Libya at that time

American prisons are less about rehabilitation and more about punishment. Always have been, always will be until the prison system is reformed and slavery is outlawed as punishment for criminal acts.

I cannot think of a single benefit the modern world has gotten from prison rehabilitation. No inventions, no humanitarians, nothing good.

On the other hand there's countless cases of recidivism and past victims being murdered by supposed "rehabilitated" criminals.

Criminal is a wide category. People can be convicted of things they didn't do, or things that never happened. People have been convicted for murder when they killed in self defense.
Stealing a loaf of bread is a crime. murder and torture are a crime. They aren't equivalent in severity.

The Elite are killing people in the heat of combat. Thats much more justified than executing a criminal. In real life criminals do not have superpowers.

blah blah blah

Your definition of due "process" is ass. All it has amounted to in real life is a terror state in which innocents not only live in fear of criminals but pay for their food and housing. You are pro crime. No two ways about it. You support criminals and support their harm of the innocent.

even though this hasn't been the case for the entirety of human history until very recently

Historically, governing bodies have often killed political threats or undesirables, regardless of any lack of legal justification.

It's primarily cause as pointed out, this kind of thing would be better as a full on story and not a single issue. Especially if we had other superheroes weighing in on how they view the Elite's methods. But such is comic books.

governing bodies have often killed political threats or undesirables

threats

undesirables

Gee, I wonder why a government might kill people who can be called that.

literally onscreen you see the big-headed aliens about to be swallowed by the street. I did post an image of them too, you haven't. Like how you can't tell apart obvious wordplay because it would make yours elf-insert look bad. I'm gonna punch you across the room if this keeps up.

Slippery slopes can happen; that they don't always happen is a testament to those who have actual principles and ethics beyond "fuck you, got mine". The point I'm making is that preventing a slippery slope from happening is better than letting one happen and going "whoops, kinda fucked up there, oh well". Superman letting The Elite do their thing without stepping in would've eventually led to the kind of shit that exemplified Kira: violence and death in the name of what The Elite considered to be "the greater good", regardless of who that "greater good" would ultimately hurt or leave behind.

And I'll keep mentioning Kira because he became a killer after coming into possession of great power. The Elite had great power, and they saw it as a way to enforce their idea of "the greater good" just like Kira used the Death Note to enforce his idea of "the greater good". Both The Elite and Kira started out killing people who "deserved" to be killed. But whereas Superman stopped The Elite before they could go further than that, Kira wasn't stopped until he'd killed thousands of people, including people whose only "crime" was trying to catch Kira.

Power revealed The Elite and Kira as fascist sociopaths who wanted to use their powers to instill their morality and their ideas of justice upon the world. Their intentions may have been noble, but their actions sure as shit weren't.

The thing is that the The elite weren't killing random criminals, they were killing superpowered people in a fight.
It's not the same as kira, and (at least from the original comic issue) there's nothing to show they would have gone as far as him.
Kira was killing normal people in prison.

To be fair the elite got a single comic issue, and Death note was an entire series. i havent watched the cartoon either.

Because they can. Because they want to. Because it's easier to blame a scapegoat and say "killing these people will make the world better" than to actually solve the problems that the scapegoats are being blamed for.

Due process is important for many reasons. For instance, people can be framed.

Something being important does not make it universal. Ask Liberia how well their due process works and why they even need vigilante justice.

Dark Knight Returns government lapdog superman becomes less out of character ever year.

Because they can

Jesus Christ. They do it because any government, regardless of how "good" or "bad" it is, has to remove threats if it wants to fucking function. Any government that doesn't do so is completely nonfunctional and tantamount to anarchy.

people can be framed.

The amount of successful framings in history statistically insignificant compared to the amount of confirmed thieves, rapists, and murders who have been hung.

Liberia

That's a demographic issue.

The thing is that the The elite weren't killing random criminals, they were killing superpowered people in a fight.

It's not the same as kira, and (at least from the original comic issue) there's nothing to show they would have gone as far as him.

And that's my argument here: Yes, The Elite were arguably using their powers for good, but with their popularity rising and their approach being received well by the masses, they likely would've turned to senseless killing sooner or later. That's what Superman was trying to show the world: You don't want people with extraordinary power deciding who gets to live and die based on, say, how those people feel on a given day.

Kira was killing normal people in prison.

The first two people he killed were a guy holding kids hostage and some dumbshit biker who was harassing a woman. He eventually went on to kill an FBI agent, then use the Death Note to make that agent's widow kill herself - and both murders were to protect himself, not to punish lawbreakers. Power reveals who someone really is, and Kira was revealed to be a sociopathic egomaniac. In time, The Elite's power - if left unchecked - would've done the same, given that they were more than ready to kill Superman.

I'm talking about first world countries like the usa. I'm not familiar with liberia or the state of their society.

For what it's worth, Kira in the comics notes that once he was through with all the criminals, he was going after the people who were "useless to society" such as NEETs and the disabled. Not to mention he was already killing off FBI agents who were on his trail, aka the same people who would nominally be on his side in upholding the law, proving he didn't care about the law so much as his vision of reality coming true.

Which can be comparable to how the Elite in the comics state that if any superheroes, aka guys who also want the same thing as them, wanted to fight them after Superman than they were going to keep killing them as well until nobody stood up to them ever again.

The Elite is literally a critic over Marvel's own heroes at the time aka the X-Men and Avengers, and one of the books Ennis loves it because it show how morally high Superman is since he still is a huge fanboy.
The very reason of why the boys and other shit came to be after is due to he going all in on "common people with superpowers would be complete assholes like Billy Butcher and all capes in The Boys, and the few morally right would suffer holding to their morals because of them" like The Elite, who are assholes with superpowers.
These people would be the first to kneel to the likes of Darkseid and others for self survival just to continue their insane line of thought.
TL;DR they are Azkhenazi and "Centrists"

So did he do this to himself like a dumbass In-Universe?

Jesus Christ. They do it because any government, regardless of how "good" or "bad" it is, has to remove threats if it wants to fucking function. Any government that doesn't do so is completely nonfunctional and tantamount to anarchy.

Sure, but that doesn't mean they are doing a good job at removing threats.
Prison is necessary, but that doesn't mean the right people are in it.

The amount of successful framings in history statistically insignificant compared to the amount of confirmed thieves, rapists, and murders who have been hung.

How do you know this?

nothing like Metropolis happens in the usa.
If you want a case example, when the horrible criminals aren't punished by the government, and the police refuse to stop them, and only vigilante justice exists to protect eachother, that's when you're a better fit for Mexico or Liberia

Im gonna be blunt, the exact state of the cities depends on the writer and universe and whatever.
I dont know what metropolis is like. i dont remember it being portrayed as lawless.

The lack of due process is why people are getting blackbagged off the fucking streets right now because they said something mean about Bibi Netanyahu in a paper a year ago.

It's not all about framings, it's about errors, people imprisoned incorrectly or on faulty evidence. You don't need a malicious intent to imprison the wrong person. You just need to be human. Plenty of people have gone to death row only to be exonerated later. And god knows there's probably been more that we don't know about, because nobody cared enough to look, or simply because the dead can't vouch for themselves.

The lack of due process is why people are getting blackbagged off the fucking streets right now because they said something mean about Bibi Netanyahu in a paper a year ago.

It's not all about framings, it's about errors, people imprisoned incorrectly or on faulty evidence. You don't need a malicious intent to imprison the wrong person. You just need to be human. Plenty of people have gone to death row only to be exonerated later. And god knows there's probably been more that we don't know about, because nobody cared enough to look, or simply because the dead can't vouch for themselves.

I think the thing that people forget is that normal criminals aren't really comparable to people like the joker or superpowered criminals.

Capeverses are fundamentally different from real life in some regards and the same solutions would not work. People like the joker dont exist in real life, so the(very good) arguments for executing him wouldnt apply

Supes told the Elite to quit it and actually try to work with him and the rule of law.

He's a hypocrite but you're claiming he's not. That's why the comics is shit, just because you made this strawman nothing character cry like a bitch doesn't mean he didn't prove Superman wrong.

He proved himself wrong, anon. Bullies don't get to cry about being bullied themselves.

A "threat" to a government could be anything or anyone. A threat could be a terrorist or a general planning a coup, or it could just be a whistleblower trying to expose a corrupt program or a journalist reporting on government-sanctioned political killings or a writer publishing a controversial book or an opponent in an election. Putin having the FSB assassinate journalists or Erdogan ordering mass arrests of his political rivals and their associates isn't all that dramatically different from the Argentinian government under Videla rounding up and killing dissidents fifty years ago or members of The Convention during the years after the French Revolution ~200 years ago sending thousands of their social rivals to the guillotine.

History has shown the same lesson going back hundreds if not thousands of years - leaders who *can* kill just about anyone frequently *will* kill just about anyone.

I think this is a good argument.

An important thin to remember is that it's acceptable for soldiers to kill enemies, but if they aren't killed and just injured they have to be treated properly.

he starts off by verbally attacking them after they save the city. He doesnt do a good job of it.

I think the comic could have made them less sympathetic or superman more reasonable

Might makes right he wasn't disproven he just got face fucked by his own ideology and because superman is strong he is free to practice his own belief

verbally attacking

all he does is put their actions into question

The lack of due process is why people are getting blackbagged off the fucking streets right now because they said something mean about Bibi Netanyahu in a paper a year ago

1. The people you're talking about aren't ordinary people who happen to oppose zionism, but antifa freaks who each have a laundry list of other seditious threats to their name in addition to prior criminal offenses.
2. You're trying to set up a "gotcha", and it's not gonna work. You probably take me to be a literal Nazi, so you bring up an issue specifically relating to Israel, a jewish state, and want to set up a dilemma in which you can frame me as being pro-semitic because I oppose your retarded pro-crime cuckoldry. I've seen this a billion times, and it has never worked once.

nope

The people you're talking about aren't ordinary people who happen to oppose zionism, but antifa freaks who each have a laundry list of other seditious threats to their name in addition to prior criminal offenses.

prove it

He starts off by comparing them to nazis. That's a verbal attack.

Batman stopped killing because he was already getting dangerously close to copyright infringement on The Shadow, and because they didn't want to have to keep coming up with new enemies for him to fight every issue.
Meanwhile Superman originally mostly just fought bankrobbers or other easily defeated enemies he could stop without killing so that's what he did.

Then it just became kind of a standard since then that Superheroes don't kill anyone because the establishing main heroes did it.

There are countless Americans who mock Israel openly and don't get arrested. You're not fooling anyone.

You blatantly support a fascistic executioner state, ignoring that lawful and just are never the same. Is it just to be executed for committing the crime of insulting Xinnie the Pooh? No. Is it lawful? Yes. We get it, you want to be the one behind the gun who gets to make the life and death decisions based on your capricious retardation, but that's because you were an accident your parent(s) resented.

And now China is the new focus of your concern troll routine. I know you're stupid, but come on. Take a hint.

Does china actually kill people for insulting Xi? Or are you exaggerating?

1. The people you're talking about aren't ordinary people who happen to oppose zionism, but antifa freaks who each have a laundry list of other seditious threats to their name in addition to prior criminal offenses.

So why hasn't the government released the info on what they actually did?
I think he's talking about the greencard holders who got arrested. They were apparently legal residents but not citizens.

So the guy that made a good point

It's NOT a good point, that's the whole point of the scene.

For a guy who's spent several posts arguing that Superfags represent a dangerous mindset which allows real-life governments to abuse their citizens you sure seem happy when glowies exercise their ability to vanish random people.

greencard holders

Surely this is of no relevance whatsoever.

More concern trolling. You're even using that hip alt-right lingo like "glowie"! (But you're hesitant say glowNIGGER because that would mean doing a heckin racism)

For a guy who's spent several posts arguing that Superfags represent a dangerous mindset which allows real-life governments to abuse their citizens you sure seem happy when glowies exercise their ability to vanish random people.

could be different people

I think he's talking about the greencard holders who got arrested. They were apparently legal residents but not citizens.

Yes, and this entitles them to freedom of speech. It certainly entitles them to due process. There's no point in going through the EXTENSIVE vetting process of becoming a citizen if you can just be yeeted out if you look askance at a certain country doing certain war crimey things.

Because they're going after easy prey first. If you're not some rich asshole they'll come for you eventually.

That's the point though. Superman's supposed to come off as being a little unreasonable and the Elite are supposed to come off as being a little sympathetic. It's easy to see why people support them in the beginning because their position seems so reasonable... at first.

That's the point though - nobody starts off wanting to support heinous shit, but it's a slippery slope to go from justifying and making excuses for summary violence and vengeance against the worst of the worst to doing it for petty criminals or innocent people.

>Because they're going after easy prey first. If you're not some rich asshole they'll come for you eventually.

"First they came for for criminals, and I did not speak up because I am not a criminal, and then they came for me for no reason whatsoever."
You are the reason soijaks exist.

Does china actually kill people for insulting Xi? Or are you exaggerating?

They didn't used to. You would get fined or, at worst sent to a work camp if you were egregious about it, but until about last year they didn't. Now with the 'three (or third, depending on translation) dragons' policy which is more or less deifying Xi, people have been disappeared for posts directly criticizing Xi. I think the tipping point was the Evergrande collapse a year or two ago.

What makes the woman who got snatched up by ICE a criminal *other than* the say-so of the government? That's the point here: When the government can say you're a criminal and deny you due process *because* it says you're a criminal, they'll go after the "acceptable" targets first before they eventually spread to everyone whose only "crime" is criticizng the government.

Greencard holders exercising free speech aren't criminals though.

It's not a matter of if you want it or not, it's just how it is. You don't choose the rules of the universe.
A lot of people who say "might is right" aren't celebrating that fact. They're just engaging with reality.

That being said, Manchester was just being an edgelord. If the strong do what they will, it says a lot about you to act like a dick when you're strong. Even from a purely self-interested angle, you're just inviting problems.

glowie

alt-right

If you're posting on tumblr in the year 2018, perhaps. You need to learn how to operate. This thread isn't good for anything but attention-whoring, now.

The elite 5 was correct in the first half. Any criminal actively killing people deserves to be killed at the scene. Not clumsily and riskily captured at the expense of more lives and property so they can break out in a few weeks and start over. But they couldn't have nuance so they make them tyrant's just taking the whole planet

Do you have an actual counter argument for what he said?
How do you know the people who were detained were actual criminals if there was not due process?

The part were manchester black says thanks for the just cause after superman stops them from killing the MIB parodies is where his character shows.

Do you have an actual counter argument for what he said?

All he said is spiteful wishful thinking.

Yeah, so my side is full criminals and they arrested one of my people, but they're gonna get you too, chud, just wait and see!

Not worth any real effort.

No no, anon! The gubbermint would NEVER choose to turn unchecked power into despotism! That's never happened, and you're a (((((((zoilent)))))))) drinking cuck for even daring to think a government isn't correct at all times, especially when granted unaccountable free reign!

How do you know they were actually part of that group?
Did you see them commit crimes personally?

I argue it's more that Superman is supposed to come off as insecure and uptight compared to the Elite, whose methods sound like they make sense but constantly showcase their general callousness in ways that make them look quirky and funny at first until you realize that they're very much dangerous unhinged individuals. Shit like how Manchester casually jokes about lobotomizing a space whale, or watching Hat pass out at a console in a drunken stupor.

That's why the title is "What's so funny about truth, justice, and the american way" since the Elite essentially treat this shit as just a joke. Like the entire idea of due process and justice is just pointless jargon instead of something worth debating, and that they can dismiss Superman as "old fashioned" compared to them since they live in the "real world" compared to him. Which is why the fact they understand less than they think they do about how superhero comics work is so often missed, since their idea that they can just kill all the bad guys will realistically never hold up any more than Superman's methods would due to the cyclical nature of comics, but people would probably prefer Superman's preaching of mercy compared to the Elite's methods of "kill them all and let god sort it out" if they were real. For all Manchester's Black's screeching that Superman lives in a dream world, it's still preferable to his flat understanding of reality, since justice shouldn't be the joke he thinks it is.

I think it's crazy that Superheroes adhere to the No-kill rule fanatically, but I can understand why someone like Superman or Batman would generally adhere to it. They work with law enforcement, and those guys barely tolerate them, given that they are vigilantes who operate outside the law.

The fact that they don't act as judge and executioner is probably the only reason they haven't been under much scrutiny, as the criminals are still arrested, put on trial, and imprisoned, meaning they still go through a legal process.

In a philosophical/moral perspective? Just like Mark from Invincible, Superman sees humanity with potential and he wants humanity to show mercy when mercy is available. Yeah, Supes can kill every problem that threatens them, but that sets a bad precedent, where any problem, no matter how threatening it is, has to be destroyed, which honestly sounds eugenic in a way.

Mark shares the same sentiments as Batman, where many people can be redeemed, no matter how evil they seem. And for Harley Quinn and others, it does sometimes works. There's element of humanity and atonement that superheroes usually have that defines them.

Do they go overboard for people like Darkseid or the Joker? Yeah, of course. And I honestly think certain villains should be killed on sight. But overall, I like how superheroes have all this power, but they choose restraint, because moral restraint is just as important as a virtue, and you want that as a core message instead of being 40k levels of edgy where the leader of humanity was literally a fanatical atheist that murdered all religious people, mutants, aliens, sentient robots, and those who oppose his tyranny by the trillions, yet you still have 40k fans thinking somehow this genocidal tyrannical monster is the "good" guy who had morals.

but he cries at the end

Really? That's the entire argument? The writer made him a pathetic coward so now his point is null? You do realize this story only works because Superman is simply the strongest and nobody can challenge his power, right?

poor kid is desperate to have the last word

when did this happen lol

Western values are so fucked up that they'd rather have more victims instead of properly dealing with criminals and terrorists. No wonder western society is in decline.

But Superman doesn't rule the world in the end. His whole point was to show the world that The Elite's approach was wrong and that what he stands for - Truth, Justice, and the American Way - is an approach best tempered with mercy than with bloodlust.

Yes, but that's only because superman is a nice person. The point about might making right still holds true (and its why people in power need to be held accountable).

Superman isn't real, and he's allowed to be overly idealistic. His whole thing is that he tries to show the world an ideal it can live up to, and that means not simply killing people for the sake of it, even if they might be dangerous. The Elite killing someone who is a legitimate threat to the safety of the innocent is morally justifiable. But if they had been allowed to keep going - and since they were willing to kill Superman, they would've - the chances they would've killed people who weren't immediate threats would keep increasing day after day.

its implied but i feel like they could have hinted at this better.

Western education was so fucked up by authoritarians that it made dipshits like that anon who'd walk into a woodchipper with a smile on his face if the government said he was a criminal.

The Elite's fundamental problem is that Superman exists in their world so their "might" isn't actually all that warranted.

It's warranted but Superman is the strongest and bestest and they're crybabies so they don't get to point out how murderers get off scot free.

That's the whole point of the title of the story: The Elite see Superman's approach to crimefighting and such as backwards-ass and archaic; they believe their violent approach is a better way to handle criminals. Superman ends up showing them that their approach is bullshit by subjecting them to it and letting Manchester show off how much of a little bitch he is when he's on the business end of the violence.

Literally yes. It's like the existence of a modern state doesn't anymore warrant knight-errants gallivanting the countryside disposing personal justice

t. criminal

Literally yes

And that's why the comic is garbage.

Did you miss the point of the scene, or what? Supes does things like the Elite would. Makes it look like he just offed them one by one and proved that because he's stronger that he can enforce his will however he wants, just like they did.

Earlier, he challenged them on that philosophy and they were all petulant little faggots about it, because they didn't think they'd ever be on the receiving end. Then Supes did it to them and proved his point to them. Might Makes Right is a nightmare and probably shouldn't be how justice is doled out.

how do we know you arent a criminal?

So move somewhere else then. There's no line to emigrate to Africa or the Middle East if you want a more "traditional" justice system.

The people you're talking about aren't ordinary people who happen to oppose zionism

They literally are, one of them was a woman who just wrote a fucking article about boycotting Israel. The other guy who got sent to that shithole Louisiana literally followed every fucking rule and law the uni told him to follow, but they didn't care. They tried to detain him for overstaying on a Visa, found out he fucking wasn't, and kidnapped him anyway. Because that's what your side does.

but antifa freaks who each have a laundry list of other seditious threats to their name in addition to prior criminal offenses.

OH NO THEY'RE GONNA TOPPLE OVER TRASHCANS, TRUMP PLEASE END FREE SPEECH NOW NOW NOW
God I fucking hate republicans and I FUCKING HATE DEMOCRATS FOR BEING REPUBLICANS TOO

You probably take me to be a literal Nazi

Don't fucking cry "YOU CALL EVERYONE NAZIS!" when you defend literal gestapo shit

so you bring up an issue specifically relating to Israel, a jewish state

It's a religious ethno apartheid state, it's nazi shit

one of them was a woman who just wrote a fucking article about boycotting Israel

And how is that a crime worthy of ICE agents basically kidnapping her off the street and the federal government revoking her visa?

I'm already is Dubai.

im sorry for your loss

if you don't like murderers and rapists receiving 4 years because "muh rehabilitative justice system", then go somewhere where they cut the heads off of thieves

False dichotomy. We had a perfectly fine justice system 50 years ago.

Show me an example of someone convicted of murder receiving a sentence of four years.

Of course, rape is wrong and the right thing to do is to try to stop it.
I'm not sure what your argument would be, unless you were believing my argument was that it's okay.

Why doesn't muh slippery slope apply to all punitive measures?

Show me an example of someone convicted of murder receiving a sentence of four years.

In some european countries thats the case for milder scenarios with mitigating factors.
But in the usa sentences that low are going to be for manslaughter or accidental deaths.

What's amazing is how many people who are arguing so vehemently against due process may very well be the same sort of people who'd argue the whole metoo movement was bullshit. A random woman says you raped her when you've never met her before, looks like it's time to die!

Thats not really the argument, Superman is demonstrating that true strength comes from allowing freedom and a controlled level of descent in the form of civil piety and public speaking, but a firm and just ruler also knows when to put his foot down at rebelious little shits who think they have something to prove. Your own logic would lead one to belive all kings in history are inherently evil when thats just not true, strength is a virtue and so is kindness and piety. Superman isnt JUST strong, hes an advocate for truth justice and the American way and you know that and are being intellectually dishonest.

They aren't, anon was agreeing with you.

PLAY BY MY RULES

okay *wins*

NOOOO NOT LIKE THAT

In some european countries thats the case

Again, examples.

manslaughter or accidental deaths

Are not the same as murder. Stop shifting the goal posts - show me someone in any country getting a four year sentence for murder. Otherwise quit making up horseshit to support your argument.

I think that was a different anon basically agreeing with you, that that sort of thing only happens for milder cases where it's not like, a straight-out slaughter. Basically trying to explain where anon might've gotten the idea that kind of thing happens and how they're misreading the information.

I thought Supeman's POV was that they can't go around executing criminals without trial.
Not that you can't use force.

you can see why that would trigger antifa-lovers because they believe if your emotions tell you someone is evil you can do whatever you want to them.

So basically anyone that isn't (You) is your enemy?

This retarded edgelord argument again? *Sigh*

Yes, you finally get it. Me good because me is meeeeeeeeeee.

Keshiro's whole schtick is slaughtering bandits, raiders, and other assorted thugs

The average Kamen Rider has little qualms about killing criminals

You have zero self awareness.