Why does Kirby's Darkseid feel almost completely detached from what he is now as some overwhelming embodiment of...

Why does Kirby's Darkseid feel almost completely detached from what he is now as some overwhelming embodiment of evil? What happened? How'd we get here?

John Byrne

Grant Morrison fundamentally misunderstands Darkseid.

he's a thanos ripoff to everybody who doesnt actually read kirby but praise him

Paul Levitz I guess

They are nothing alike beside physical appearance

the thing is he's not even a good thanos ripoff, thanos spends most of his time being a complete schizo trying to score with the concept of death itself and being pals with adam warlock, darkseid is just space sauron at this point but less cool

Thanos First Appearance The Invincible Iron Man #55 Februrary 1973

Darkseid First Appearances Superman's Pal Jimmy Olsen #134 December 1970

yeah i know man
kirby's darkseid feels unique, current darkseid is ass and feels like he's taking more from thanos

Funnily enough, Thanos started as a copy of Metron

No that was Drax

No, you fundamentally don’t understand Kirby.

Leave it to the manchildren who only read comics to lack basic reading comprehension.
Not even that anon.

I mean, you didn't get the hint that Darkseid as a character had completely gone of the rails from that time they turned him into a baby?

It’s 54 years of multiple different writers with wildly different writing style and approach to comics when compared to Kirby working on the character over various different books and storylines so it’s only natural the character has evolved and been interpreted differently over thr years and feels different from the time when he was just a stand-in for Richard Nixon. This is how serialised fiction works. Things are changed and revamped and you have to reinvent and find new ways for a character to work and it’s only natural that writers like Morrison have influenced the approach to writing Darkseid

He is evil as fuck, in the New Gods finale he lures Orion into a firing squad lol. I will say tho, the recent writers push his evilness to the point that planet Apocolypse couldnt even be a functional society whereas in Kirby's stories it would still be a seminormal world with working people not just endless slaves and monsters.

Superman the Animated Series happened.
With it and Justice League he became just the final boss for Superman/the Justice League.

Kirby's Darkseid was meant to be a cartoonishly evil dictator however he was never the main focus of the story. Him and his pointless quest were just the backdrops for everyone else's stories in the Fourth World Saga. Then at some point in the 90's he eclipsed the New Gods in popularity and became the central figure. So now he's an evil sociopath who's always one step ahead of everyone as a means of keeping him relevant.

Kirby's Darkseid is basically a different character. Almost all of the key points about Darkseid were invented by later writers without Kirby's input.

He's the Before Watchmen of the 1980s.

In what way is he detached?

feels different from the time when he was just a stand-in for Richard Nixon

Wait, what? Are you saying that's what Kirby's Darkseid was?

Then at some point in the 90's he eclipsed the New Gods in popularity and became the central figure.

Not the 90s: 1985. The 1985 season of Superfriends used Darkseid with his son Kalibak and Desaad but not his other son Orion or New Genesis at all.

Nixon mixed with Hitler/Stalin.
4th world name is a reference to the cold war's "3 worlds" divide.

Or earlier. Both the Titans/x-men saga and great Darkness Saga used Darkseid as the big bad. There’s been this idea at DC that you can use Darkseid as this big, mic-drop villain for a while

I think the thing is that Morrison read this one panel and thought it was cool without realizing he's just hyping himself up extraordinarily.
Same thing with DARKSEID IS, that originated from all of his cronies from Apokolips being his hype men but now it's some abstract "yeah Darkseid is all the bad things ever."

Every single character older than like 10 years feels completely detached from what they originally were.

he is the tiger-force of all things

Literally me fr

/thread

Kirby's Darkseid is also fairly measured in self-awareness, pontificating on how his existence and rule is transitory, and how beings worse than him are inevitable.

Tiger Force at the core of all things

vehicle line is all repaints

There should be a GI Joe group who does nothing but falseflags against people who are mutual enemies of the USA and Cobra using pilfered or copied Cobra gear.

Almost all of the key points about Darkseid were invented by later writers without Kirby's input.

He's the Before Watchmen of the 1980s.

Aren't all the key points in Watchmen from the original 12 issues?

DC wanted him to be the top final boss of the universe and they never ever stop playing him up. Even if he has few great showings in any book, post Morrison Darkseid is now some all consuming element of evil in the multiverse that takes the form of a rocky guy in a miniskirt.

Why does Kirby's Darkseid feel almost completely detached from what he is now as some overwhelming embodiment of evil? What happened? How'd we get here?

the rule is dc fumbles the new gods characters and anything close to the original kirby vision or departing from that but still good is the exception

get called out for being a retard and marvel shill

n-no it's you that misread what I said.

How often do people actually think of this?

DC wanted him to be the top final boss of the universe

Can't do that when you don't have an ending. Final Crisis could've worked as the grand finale but it wasn't. Shit continued afterwards until Flashpoint which doesn't work either. Nor does Doomsday Clock.

This.

You can't keep that kind of aura up for over 50 years

NUTS!

Because Kirby didn’t mean him as the end all be all death of all existence, overpowered just-shy-of-the-source reality-breaker. Ffs he was pissing his pants when Orion was attacking his base.

I would say it’s grant more than Byrne but I’d also say it was Johns even more. I don’t dislike any of them, in fact Byrne and Morrison are two of my favorite creators, and I do like much of johns work, but the three of them really did a number on the new gods.

No, you just latched on to Morrison speaking of the new gods as concepts rather than the characters they actually were.

I’m so sick of this faggot ass defense mechanism.

characters that become go-to event comic fodder swiftly lose most of what made them good in the first place. same reason there is no thanos story worth reading that wasn't written by starlin

Truth hurts, deal with it

in the New Gods finale he lures Orion into a firing squad

While absolutely shitting himself at the possibility that Orion will reach him. Which means he:
1. Feared him
2. Didn’t have the stomach to do the job he forced faceless moooks to do
3. Believed the guns the faceless mooks had could finish off the guy he feared so much

He’s demented but I’d say less evil than desaad in kirby’s books. In the forever people he kinda gives an eye roll to how creepy and over the top desaad is about his torture. Darkseid is a pragmatist and egomaniac but he’s not the embodiment of evil like later writers made him. He’s just a typical dictator.

t-t-truth hurts!

Cute but I’m not hurt by the reality, I’m annoyed by the fact that faggot ass fan fic writers like you actually believe it’s a valid defense from all criticism.

He’s just a typical dictator.

I think the title "The New Gods" was misleading if Kirby conceptualized him as just a typical dictator in outer space, not a god who's the Platonic form of tyrant.
You could say he mismarketed his work.

Worse than Darkseid? How?

"Where the gods astronauts"?

why don't we have cool toys like this anymore

antisemites probably.