Superhero families are stupid and way too damn overcrowded

Superhero families are stupid and way too damn overcrowded.

There should only ever be 1 Batgirl, Barbara. None of the other ones, and no Batwoman either

There should only be Nightwing and one other Robin. You can keep Jason too as long as he's dead.

There should only be Superman and Supergirl. thats it. end of discussion.

There should only be at most 3 human GLs

There should only be Jay Garrick, Barry Allen (dead), and Wally West and Jay should be retired and only help out on rare occasions.

Peter Parker should be the only Spider-Man but im open to having Jessica there too as fapbait.

Logan is the only Wolverine. Period. Laura should be x23 or Talon ( I think Talon sounds stupid but if theyre calling x23 a slave name she needs something). I'll allow Daken but he should have his own adventures elsewhere. Also he should be a villain, not an anti hero

ok

inb4 faggots complain about "reddit" spacing

There should only be Nightwing and one other Robin. You can keep Jason too as long as he's dead

Fuck off, nerd

fuck you faggot

Yeah, they jumped the shark with the bat family crap
Missing all the solemn tones

Just one of many reasons why modern capeshit is unreadable slop.

No. Just one Batman, one Robin, no other sidekicks.

Every time you fags complain they add another one, fucking stop.

why are you mad, he's right

I like a large Batfamily, I just hope they can come up with a better storyline that

Batman judges a cock sucking contest

Every Outsiders issue is basically that.

Batman and Robin: Year One

Batman: The Last Halloween

Batman/Superman: World's Finest

Why aren't you buying these?

Here's my Batfam roster :)

Yeah, I agree OP. When you’ve got forty other people running around in tights beating up bad guys just as good as Batman or five different Fastest Men Alives it kinda dilutes the whole thing. Fun fact, in the late 90s, Marvel did away with USAgent, Thunderstrike, and War Machine for, per Tom Brevoort, that very reason, that they were diluting the original. Now every Marvel character has at least five variations, one for each minority

:)

legs crossed out

kek

no alfred

gay

It works for Batman because you've got a sprawling metropolitan city for a setting, no one has superpowers, and you've got multiple titles so you don't have to write what is functionally a team book all the time.

Batwoman and Bat-girl predate Barbara. You're just picking and choosing what you like.

AH FUCK I DID NOT REALIZE I CROSSED OUT ALFRED, lemme fix that

Only faggots reddit space, faggot. Cry like the bitch you are.

No.
However, nobody reads Batman for muh batfamily. They don't all need to be shoehorned into every goddamn thing, just yo stand around and be cheapened. Remember absence makes hearts grow fonder; fields must lay fallow from time to time.

You're just picking and choosing what you like.

no duh

i agree with you op but its hilarious how it technically doesnt even matter. when you read batman or detective comics, the extended batfamily rarely if ever appears. I dont read efvents so idk if they show u much there but if you only read bruce wayne books, you barely see any of them. you might see damian but thats about it. They are so unnecessary they barely show up which begs the question why even have them in the first place but whatever

The Arkham games also proved you only need Batman and Oracle, with the rest being there to sell DLC.

Yeah, but the Arkham games showcased how utterly boring Batman is alone and the only person is someone over a radio. There's a reason why Gotham Knights, despite how bad it was, had memorable character interactions that ran circles around what the Arkham games had (with the exception of Origins because that one isn't tied to the Arkham games).

the only good thing about gotham knights is barbara's ass

Babs sucked in that game because she wasn't the bitch who tells everyone to get their shit together while also being a wreck herself. Gimme that Babs and give the Batgirl mantle to someone who can actually rock it, like Steph.

the only person is someone over a radio

That's fine. She can see and hear everything.

who is the black guy on the bottom left? who is the robot next to duke ? who are the two bitches on the right of batlesbian ?

Batwing
Jim Gordon when he was Mecha-Batman during Snyder's run
Bette Kane, and Julia Pennyworth, Alfred's daughter.

This is my Batfamily, except replace Kate with Alfred.

thanks, anon.

Batwing

he's in africa, right?

Jim Gordon when he was Mecha-Batman during Snyder's run

i thought he looked like picrel? just a case of different artists ?

Superhero families are stupid and way too damn overcrowded.

There are a handful of cases where they can be done ok, but yeah, it's stupid when every hero has five other people with cloned powers. Like others have said, it makes the main hero less special.

p but its hilarious how it technically doesnt even matter. when you read batman or detective comics, the extended batfamily rarely if ever appears.

This. We have these threads every fucking week, maybe 2 or 3 times a week, and it's always the same fucking old images at this point because they've slowly paired down how many even show up regularly.
No one ever discusses the various minis DC does with a solo or classic Batman with only Dick as a sidekick at best.
Most people complaining aren't comic readers and likely just know older comics or(more likely) media and get shellshocked seeing these batfamily images that come from events and think Grifter is a batfamily member.

mostly correct

nightwing is obviously his own thing. jason works as red hood. tim should be the robin. morrison fucked up with damian. babs is always better as oracle and cass works as the next generation with tim. kathy should've been a temporary thing out of 52 when burce wasn't wearing the cowl. huntress is fine as a female punisher-lite. everybody else can get thrown into the sun

superman and supergirl are OGs. superboy (kon) should be the only other one. irons is better as an engineer with steel just him temporarily carrying the torch during death of superman

jay should be JSA. barry should've stayed dead and wally as main flash

4 GLs worked pre-nu 52 bullshit. guy as honor guard. hal as the solo. stewart as the JLA GL. and kyle out doing weird fun cosmic shit. maybe throw in jessica as a rotating recruit or some shit but that's it

peter should be the only spidey. no miles, no gwen, no spider-verse faggotry. totally ruins his character. jessica is technically unrelated so that's "fine." since she's hydra/spy shit

logan and x23 works. talon should be thrown into the sun. daken is fine as a bastard kid since logan is 200 years old

No one ever discusses the various minis DC does with a solo or classic Batman with only Dick as a sidekick at best.

It's also because it's very boring. Dick as Robin is the equivalent of undercooked white rice.

he's in africa, right?

Like a year into the Batwing book, it wasn't selling well and they realized they didn't have a black batfamily member and made the african Batwing retire, made Lucius' son Luke Fox Batwing and bought him to Gotham because Africa is too hard to deal with and Batman Inc was winding down anyway.

And yet you constantly have people saying how they need to reboot back to dick as Robin, then never actually supporting Dick as Robin books

Crossing out Azrael

He's unironically the only one who has a decent actual story setup in the whole mix. A guy who wanted to be Batman when Batman was out of commission and took a much more brutal and unforgiving nature to showcase why Batman has to stop being so 'Safe'. Instead, he proved a stark reminder of what Batman could be if he went all out and all the negative things that came with it and the much worst place Gotham is for it. He sets out to be an edgy Batman but instead reminds the rest of them why it's important for Batman to be as tempered as he is despite hiding in the shadows, and is rightfully replaced with the better original when Bruce returns to take back the cowl. Post that he now has to figure out his own path with Bruce's much better ideal as a guide.

He's unironically got a better setup for being Jason than Jason half the time. None of the Superboy Prime baggage and all of the "Batman should be more brutal" storyline.

im starting to think op made this thread complaining about the batfamily but secretly its because he wants to discuss the batfamily. you sneaky curr, you

tim should be the robin. morrison fucked up with damian

Why do you want Gay Robin so bad?

i agree, maybe have jason in bludhaven instead? i don't know, dick would probably stop him too

outlaws kinda worked with him being international and mercing literal whos instead would work i guess

Dude isn't shaking the foundations of anything, even his 90s stuff which is considered his peak feels so... basic. All of this stuff is pretty basic.

Alright I'll bite since I like hearing alt takes on story ideas, who among the crossed out do you think has a better setup for a story? That's the "mix" I was talking about. Obviously someone like Alfred alone as a character and story potential could mog him, but everyone else just seems either really uninteresting or done way better by someone else without the added baggage.

Thunderstrike was already dead by the mid 90s when his solo book ended, but yes, they were going to kill US Agent, but someone within Marvel did save him, and he got a redesign in the Maximum Security event instead. IIRC someone felt War Machine should be a villain name, so Rhodey was retired and there was a new evil War Machine in late 90s Iron Man.

Jessica's connection to Spider-Man is having "Spider" in her name and original comic did lots of different shit with her that wouldn't work with Spider-Man. You shouldn't be calling her a Spider-family character.

Jason's storylines in comics and other media are much, much better than Nightwings.

He has ONE story- UTH. He has nothing but that. You can't do anything after that because he can't kill anyone of consequence.

He's got all the best comics. The only Titans run anyone even knows about is his run. The Titans show people liked was about him. BTAS got worse when he left with the art change and his origin episode is still amazing to this day. He's got all the history with Batman.

Other robins can't compare.

Why do you guys want Punisher-lite Jason? That's lame. Jason has the most connections to Gotham City itself which will never get explored because people are infatuated with him just murdering people.

technically he's bi, but obviously editorial will never have him with a woman again. i hate steph but if some tim/steph shipper somehow becomes a writer and has them get back together to soft cloest this bullshit woke era, i will begrudgingly accept it

teacher's bitch

gotham will always need a batman. seethe and cope

conner

conner is a good character and young justice/teen titans works the best with tim/conner. og dick teen titans loses its appeal when he becomes nightwing and titans is better as the "older" book

tec/batman shit

again seethe and cope. one book has historically been batman (& robin) solo book and the other book has has more of the supporting characters

Tim Drake was his real rival in terms of Robin rivalry. Tim was THE Robin for decades until Dick decided to kick him off the role.

What if you merge Dick with Jason? Have Dick die to Joker, and he later comes back as Red Hood.

the other anon is correct though. the longer jason operates in gotham and kills dudes, the less it makes sense and undermines batman

therefore there are 2 options. jason operates out of a different location or he gets used very sparingly and shows up to merc somebody like in hush/3 jokers/or whatever flavor of the year event and disappears for years in between

There should only be Superman and Supergirl

and krypto, superboy (with the leather jacket), and steel

He's got all the best comics.

He doesn't even have the best Robin run. Hell, Tim's run runs circles around Dick's solo Nightwing run at its best.

The only Titans run anyone even knows about is his run

And it sucks lol. Overrated for the era and doesn't hold up.

saving people is for robins. not to mention he died and came back to life. he should absolutely be mad at bruce for dying to the joker. if he comes back to life and is just another hero then he's just another robin or nightwing which i dont know if youve been paying attention to the thread but i find the overcrowding of similar characters a problem.

people are infatuated with him just murdering people.

Traffickers aren't people.

this nigga gets it

that doesn't work because dick growing and getting sick of bruce's shit is one of the hard character growth moments in comics that hasn't been undone

and jason dying because bruce tried to fit a square peg into a round hole is also solid stuff. plus it only cements joker to complete THAT MOTHERFUCKER status. it's batman's greatest failure. the robin suit sitting in the cave is batman kino, you can't lose that

i agree, maybe have jason in bludhaven instead?

They did that in OYL already when he was gonna replace Dick as Nightwing and they told Didio no.

Tim was THE Robin for decades

That's exactly why its easy to state Dick is just better. It's not like the dude didn't have time in the role, he had plenty of time to prove it in both the comics and shows, and frankly he just could not measure up. He's nowhere near as recognizable, his stories aren't a tenth as memorable, you don't even know his not-titans team, he's a character who got pushed but never had that one really memorable story or appearance that just cements him as being worth the time. Dick could, as Robin. Him having less as Nightwing and his most famous one being when he stopped being Nightwing to be Other-Batman is beside the point, Dick as Nightwing brought it. Tim just plain didn't

therefore there are 2 options. jason operates out of a different location or he gets used very sparingly and shows up to merc somebody like in hush/3 jokers/or whatever flavor of the year event and disappears for years in between

Reminds me of the time DC decided that Jason shouldn't associate with the Batfamily and Gotham and took him out of it, and it was fucking dogshit. Taking Jason out of Gotham and away from Bruce and the team is like taking Guy Gardner out of the GLC because he's in Hal Jordan's shadow. At the end of the day, that character was better off with than without.

Who gives a shit about the comics? I'm talking about adaptations IE the shit that actually matters.

Doesn't work. The entire point of the Dick-Jason dichotomy is that Dick is the "Good son", the success story that let Bruce get used to the idea of doing it again and subsequently being crushed when it utterly blows up in his face. Dick going evil doesn't work because he was the Robin who became his own hero as an opposite to Jason, both of their stories get worse combining them. No good-son to showcase the tragedy of what Jason could've been, and no Jason to showcase what could become of Nightwing if he goes too far.

DC tries so hard to appease faggots like OP by shoving the extended Batfamily into separate books and never acknowledging them but it doesn't work because the mere existence of the Batfamily is enough for people to complain

and jason dying because bruce tried to fit a square peg into a round hole is also solid stuff. plus it only cements joker to complete THAT MOTHERFUCKER status. it's batman's greatest failure. the robin suit sitting in the cave is batman kino, you can't lose that

Sorry but none of this actually matters. The retards in the thread want Jason as a bootleg Punisher so none of this stuff amount to anything.

i know a lot of comic fans consider Tim to be THE robin because they likely grerw up reading him as robin and it was like a resurgence of the robin mantle but I havent read much with him in it so i dont really care about him.

They should keep going because this is a stupid miserable complaint that undermines Batman's character arc of building a new family

It's not like the dude didn't have time in the role, he had plenty of time to prove it in both the comics and shows,

Tim has never been adapted properly before YJ where he's barely there.
The DCAU just used Jason and gave him Tim's name for synergy. They didn't use any of comic Tim's personality.
The arkham games made him a bald cage fighter in his 20s
Those are his two prominent adaptations and they don't use a shred of his comics version.
Even the Titans show made him a poor kid when he was in Bruce's neighborhood.

I just hate how overly bloated the cast gets in Bat event books because we have to include a bunch of panels of these guys. Court of Owls to this day like a decade later sticks out in my mind because holy shit that whole event got the legs cut out by constantly shoving in book after book into the overall story that for fucking certain did not need that Batwing appearance among many others.

I'm talking about adaptations IE the shit that actually matters.

Maps is the latest one.

The entire point of the Dick-Jason dichotomy

Not necessary. Only nerds care about that shit.

the success story that let Bruce get used to the idea of doing it again and subsequently being crushed when it utterly blows up in his face

The original dying still works since it'd prove to him that sidekicks are a bad idea

Dick going evil

Jason isn't evil, sperg.

Why do they keep on making him Jason?

yeah but that was as nightwing and it was shit

maybe have jason go to hub city since that's even worse than bludhaven and he can kill fuckers there that nobody will care about

RHATO is loved by jasonfags though

shit bait. this is about comics. go do whatever OC storylines you want in a DCU thread

this is about comics

Batman is a multimedia franchise.

undermines Batman's character arc of building a new family

Again? Batman already had this whole bullshit of building a new family ever since the Silver Age.

saving people is for robins

Except Jason loves to help people and admits that being Robin was one of the happiest moments of his life. He's a more interesting character when he's not a boring brooding loser.

The original dying still works since it'd prove to him that sidekicks are a bad idea

The idea that kid sidekicks are a bad idea is a stupid idea of itself considering Jason did the same shit Dick and later Tim would do, only he got punished for it for reasons beyond the character's control.

RHATO is loved by jasonfags though

If that was the case then it wouldn't have had dogshit sales. Anyway your ideas are fucking dogshit and you're definitely retarded.

Tim has never been adapted properly before YJ where he's barely there.

He was in the entire second half of BTAS...

The DCAU just used Jason and gave him Tim's name for synergy.

The fuck are you talking about, there's a reference or two but he's got nothing from Jason personality wise in there. He's pretty much the same as his pre-no mans land run, right down to that weird raised eye thing he does because 90's and HIP.

The arkham games made him a bald cage fighter in his 20s

Fair point for Arkham Night but he was back to being not-bald in Gotham Knights.

Even the Titans show made him a poor kid when he was in Bruce's neighborhood.

Still fucking bizarre they used him in this one, THIS was the one they were clearly hoping to use Jason for, for some reason. That shits the real synergy.

But all of this is just to say there's reasons he didn't land either in-comics or out.

TNBA started in 96/97 but tim was still newish in the comics. jason had more lore and timm is a classicfag.

The DCAU is actually pretty shit when it comes to character embargos. They just make composite characters without care.

The arkham games made him a bald cage fighter in his 20s

He wasn't bald; it was a buzzcut.

the fact that Morrison retcon that Kathy Kane was Bruce's widowed aunt by marriage makes their relationship hot and steamier than intended.

He was in the entire second half of BTAS...

In Name Only

The fuck are you talking about, there's a reference or two but he's got nothing from Jason personality wise in there

It's literally Jason's Origin. It's Jason as Robin, not Red Hood.

The fuck are you talking about, there's a reference or two but he's got nothing from Jason personality wise in there.

He doesn't know computers, isn't a Sherlock Holmes or detective fan, is far more confident than comics Tim was early on, he's even fond of cake like Jason(minor thing but basically showing they were both more youthful and childlike than comic Tim), far more headstrong
He acts smost EXACTLY like Mike Barr era Jason(which was post-crisis, I know a lot of you people confuse it for Pre-crisis because Jason is nice in it. The scarecrow episode is even a direct homage to that Barr issue, down to the ending.
Please tell me what you think resembled comics Tim from DCAU Tim.. Hell I'd argue DCAU Tim is portrayed as younger than comic Tim was.

There should only be Superman and Supergirl. thats it. end of discussion.

Nah. Conner gets to stay.

Conner gets to stay

His origin's retarded.

not to mention he died and came back to life. he should absolutely be mad at bruce for dying to the joker.

The fact that Jason can come back from the brink of total despair to save lives goes harder than him just mindlessly killing. He doesn't even have to acknowledge Bruce as a father anymore, in which case would be the true consequence of Bruce's inability to "save" Jason.

Seriously, I can't imagine comic Tim being like this at all. This is still a young kid. Comic Tim was mature for his age, which was played for laughs in YJ were he was the stuffy one compared to Kon or Bart who still acted like kids.

but im open to having Jessica there too as fapbait.

based. op is 100% correct. Marvel, hire this man

he was the stuffy one

That's lame.

We only like Julia in the Bat-threads.

i have no idea who that is. thus, i find jessica more appealing. unless you can prove otherwise, jess gets my vote

This is why people who say Jason show have stayed a villain make no sense to me. Just because he is/was mad at Bruce doesn’t mean he’s just going to give up all his morals, at the end of the day, he’s still a good guy
We can’t even get a solid supporting cast for Jess, let alone adding her to Peter's supporting cast instead

...not to mention steph was mainly a supporting character in the robin books

Respectable. I was expecting some yurifag reasoning. I guess I never thought of the "batfamily" as needing a mechanic as most adaptions lean more into the tech element but it makes sense.

Partly because Tim's setup kind of depends on Jason existing and dying.
But also because the DCAU guys stopped caring about the comics after the mid 80's until the 2000's happened and they actually too interest in them again.

Lindsay McCabe. There. Done.

She's old and busted. Her daughter is the age she'd be running around with one of those kid hero teams if anyone gave a fuck about her.

Because they're garbage, like every other current Batman title.

I’m fine with Damian because I like Tim being his own solo hero similar to Dick and Jason.

I’m mixed on John because I like the idea and message of a normal person being able to do what Superman does just by dedicating themselves to it. Also, either Chris or Jon should be there because I like the idea of Clark being a father, feels very natural to his character.

If you want to get technical, there were 5 earth GLs pre-nu52 because Alan was also calling himself Green Lantern.

I’m fine with Miles because he tends to do his own thing with his solos and the Champions separate from Peter and only really hangs out with him if there’s a dedicated team up book

I would add Gabby because of how different she is to the other Wolverines.

nta but thanks for telling me about batman and robin year one i just read the first issue and greatly enjoyed it

What about Robin: Year One?

It's awesome.

She's old and busted.

But enough about Jessica Drew who is only there because Bendis only cares about her

bendis left marvel like a decade ago

I’m shocked they didn’t make Rachel the new Spider-Girl, but I don’t think she has her mom's powers

I think anon means things currently running and not a 25 year old book

And they never recovered as a result. Take Carol Danvers for example. Still shackled to what's his face thanks to Bendis.

Does Waid's book conflict with Dixon's?

Comparing masks/brands with characters

Alright I'll bite since I like hearing alt takes on story ideas, who among the crossed out do you think has a better setup for a story?

You put me in a corner because I really don't think the crossed-out has a better set up for a story. I personally think that Azrael has played out his story well.

I don't think it does in any major way. There's some years apart in what age they're depicting Dick
The Gauntlet is another cool Dick as Robin story that's sort of overlooked these days.

Maybe something along the lines of Iron Spider, but in different colors.

So Waid's book goes after Dark Victory but before The Gauntlet?

Ever since Harold faded from memory and Alfred died, I can only assume that everyone helps out Bruce. Shit, Harper is also a medic, I don't see how she couldn't pull a double shift and help the team in medics now that Alfred is gone.

In that case, Jason isn't a person considering he also dabbled in crimes that made society worse like drug dealing and illegal arms dealing.

I would think it's after both. The Gauntlet is basically right after Robin Year One and IIRC was considered some inspiration for it, it's basically Dick's first test solo as Robin.

Arkham Batman wasn't boring because he was working alone.
Arkham Batman was boring because he had no personality beyond grunting and trying to sound intimidating every other sentence.
If he was closer to his BTAS self, he would've worked a lot better.